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i bet the wife was the one that came up with the idea of the book lolz
If he had just written one thing down, he would have been lying. Sounds like he was more interested in the book and fixing problems then she was. The whole idea is for both of them to be honest, and she was lying. EVERYONE does somethings that you cannot stand, but that doesn't mean you love them any less.
yeah, 88, the OP's wife clearly lied. and, OP, just remember, she's going to hang this incident over your head until the day you die. every little argument will include something like 'oh, well at least i don't ______________...oh wait1 I DO DO THAT, DON'T I!?!?!?!?!' have fun with it...really...
It sounds like your wife has a problem engaging in open, honest communication. Everybody does things that tick other people off. Either she doesn't think she can be critical with you or she has a temperament where she lets things build up until they boil over. Regarding #262 - he wasn't telling her her faults, he was telling her things he doesn't like. My $0.02 is to put away the books and go to a good marriage counselor that can guide the two of you into communicating more effectively.
I still can't believe some guys still fall for the "tell me all my flaws so that we can be a stronger couple" trick. Guys, it never works, girls don't like to be told what is wrong with them. subtlety working at it, acceptable. Anyway, let that be a lesson to you guys. (and always make her show her hand first)
that is not true for all women at all.. but go ahead and generalize. personally, i would much rather have gotten his list than her list. i WANT to know what i do that bothers my boyfriend so i can decide whether or not its something i can change, we can talk about it, and nothing gets bottled to explode out later. not ALL women are manipulative. not ALL women want to know what you don't like about them just so they can hold it against you. there are many women, such as myself, who genuinely want to work on things like that, especially if it means having a better relationship with somebody you love. to this guy... FYL for being honest and having a manipulative wife. don't let her throw this shit in your face, because its clearly a lie that nothing about you bothers her. straight up.
You're right; not all women are manipulative and can't stand being told their flaws. But I haven't met one. In my experience, even if a girl claims to want to be told their flaws and says they aren't manipulative, it's a lie. Also, OP, if she doesn't try to talk about it without the help of something like the book, it's absolutely loaded. Fleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
guess you'll be sleeping on the couch for a while lmao that sucks though /: it was definitely a lose lose situation.
Why would you expect him to be sleeping on the couch for that? If she is that upset she can plunk her ass down on that couch, or call her mom and spend the night there. Totally ridiculous that you'd expect him to kowtow to her after her obvious entrapment backfired. "Hey honey, we should take a look at this relationship book" - translates to, "I think our relationship has some issues we need to work out." He was honest. She was manipulative and/or fishing for compliments.
I don't think that's necessarily true, you don't have to have problems in your relationship to do those books.They might have just been trying to strengthen they're relationship, they wouldn't have to have underlying problems to do that. But with that being said you're right, she was trying to be manipulative.
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How do you think that would make her feel? Sure he was honest, but there was no reason to write a freaking list of things he didn't like. A few major things that really bothered him would've been more than enough. He hurt her feelings, and if anyone has to leave I think it should've been him.
Yeah, actually, there was plenty of reason for him to write a list of things he didn't like, seeing as that was the whole point of the exercise they both agreed to try out in an attempt to improve/strengthen their relationship. Sugarcoating what he had to say wouldn't have benefited either of them, and would have only worked against him in the long run. But then again, I'm the kind of person that values honesty over "little white lies" to spare people's feelings.
Sure, there were plenty of reasons for him to write a long list, and it seems odd that she wrote "I love everything about you" if SHE suggested the book. However, if either he suggested it (which I'm sure most of us find somewhat unlikely) or if they had to do it for some kind of therapy (seriously, how do we know?) then I don't blame her. That really blows for both of them. And we also all know that he will end up sleeping on the couch if anyone does. I'm not trying to be sexist or anything, but how often do you hear about a man making his wife sleep away from the bed? Especially since the OP clearly feels guilty about this particular event. Legitimately, it would be ridiculous for either one of them to force each other out over this, but it's very unlikely that she will be the one leaving the bed if anyone does.
Just to reply to GDinNJ (#82) - actually, I would imagine that it is far more typical for the woman to sleep on the couch in those situations. Unless the husband is a totally pussy-whipped bitch, but by that time in the relationship sex is probably so infrequent that any 'power' the woman derives from withholding it is long gone. Besides, his list of items was pretty long, which suggests that there are any number of things that his wife needs to work on, which probably shows his patience with her has been steadily eroded over the past number of years. And if she is upset, she can be the one who sleeps somewhere else. And I may be projecting with this last point, but so be it: chances are the husband has paid for the house and everything in it. This isn't 100% of course, but the vast majority of cases are like this, I assure you (yes even despite women's lib). Telling me to sleep on the couch when I've paid for the bed, and I've paid for the food, and I've paid for the house. Not going to happen.
I have to respond more generally to this comment again. "And we also all know that he will end up sleeping on the couch if anyone does. I'm not trying to be sexist or anything, but how often do you hear about a man making his wife sleep away from the bed?" Where exactly did you get this idea from - watching your parents, friends, friends parents, aunts, uncles and siblings? No you didn't. You got this idea from television. Just to clear it up: Television is fake. Every commercial, every program - yes reality shows included. Television is not some sort of documentary device. It is pure entertainment. Its fake. So your comment above, irrelevant and based on nothing credible.
I cannot for the life of me figure out why you are getting upset by my comment. I'm simply stating that the OP is clearly feeling somewhat guilty. Therefore we know that guilt will sometimes lead to a person doing something to make the person they have "offended" feel better. If a person actually loves someone, they're not going to think the way you do. I'm making the assumption that you aren't married. Just a guess. Sometimes we need to ignore our pride and do things for other people. If the OP thinks that he should sleep on the couch to win his wife back, maybe he'll do that. Even if he isn't whipped. And I second theanonimouse's statement. I cannot believe you even considered that it was a good idea to say that. At least 75% of the families in my community consist of two working parents. Sometimes the husband makes more money and sometimes the wife does. Your statement was inaccurate and, in all honesty, very offending, whether you intended it to be or not. So I apologize if my tone was unnecessarily biting, but I'm kind of annoyed with that particular part of your post.
i really fucking hope you are trolling, hoax. i don't know a SINGLE married couple in which the male buys everything. i bet that she spent just the same amount of money on the house as he did. this isn't the 1800's', you know, women actually have to get jobs. i am not even a feminist, but that is just a disgusting thing to say. as for the OP, his wife is fucking nuts and immature. if you are going to do an exercise, she might as well do it right. and crying over her husband being truthful is disgusting. she is a manipulating bitch. and she is lying, because it is impossible that she is not bothered by ANYTHING that he does. she set up theim situation so she could play victim. disgusting.
Sorry, #189, but I've actually seen this in real life. No male member of my family (immediate and extended) has made their wife sleep on the couch. A good number of the women have done so. My parents do it if one of them is sick, too. If my dad's sick, he sleeps on the couch so as to not get my mom sick. If my mom's sick, he sleeps on the couch so she can have the bed.
There are two points I suppose I should clarify. The first is that the man does not make the wife sleep on the couch - she opts to do so when he doesn't give into her nagging to do so. The second is that there are geographical culture differences that I should have made clear. In the midwest, and many other areas of the country (US) there are many dual income families. These comprise the majority of lower middle and middle class households. In the area in which I live and work, the NY metro area, there are more single income families - and these single income, married families comprise most of the upper middle class households in the US. That is to say, in the majority of cases, the upper middle class household has a working husband and a non-working wife. This should make sense, the wife doesn't need to work when the husband can comfortably support the entire family. I apologize that I took my experiences, and that of my colleagues, and extrapolated them to fit all households in the United States. To reiterate, however, the OP might feel guilty, but he rationally has no reason to do so. His wife manipulated events to precisely the conclusion that occurred - and she, of course, feels bad for doing so, after the fact. I wouldn't be surprised if she has the gall to tell him to sleep on the couch, but I would be appalled if the OP complied.
@ Hoax "The man does not make the wife sleep on the couch - she opts to do so when he doesn't give into her nagging to do so." You, sir, are a terribly sexist individual. I'm not sure if you've realized this yet, or if you'll ever admit to it, but judging by your comments here, (and I understand this is a very narrow set of circumstances from which to draw a judgement of a person's character, but just bear with me here), you seem to have a very negative view of women. Nagging, manipulative, non-working, using sex as some kind of "power" against their husbands... it almost seems to me that you may have become embittered against women for some reason... a few failed relationships, maybe? And don't act like you just weren't clear with your earlier comment about the man paying for "the house and everything in it," which you apparently assumed was true for "the vast majority of cases." If you do just so happen to be surrounded by women of such character in the upper-middle class NY metro area, I suggest you travel a bit. We aren't all that way, I swear.
I can't believe you're so blind and stuck up as to assume the husband has paid for EVERYTHING in the house. In my family, my mother makes more money then my father. I do love my dad very much, but I do know that he wouldn't pay the bills without her. For most of my family's friends, the husband has been with out a job for at least a year while the wife was the one working and earning money to live on until they picked themselves back up. You need to get off your high horse and jump back down to reality.
You know, its not terribly inaccurate to call me sexist, but I suppose it should be mitigated by explaining that I wouldn't trust most men to even take out my trash. The problem is that I suffer from a biological compulsion to always give women the benefit of the doubt, and having dealt with them for a number of years I've simply become jaded by their constant failings. I mean, I see a man do something stupid, and I have no problem chucking him into the "total moron" category. When an attractive woman does it, there is always an ambivalence to my reaction, and then I become doubly disappointed, disappointed with her and disappointed with myself, when she repeats such idiotic behavior when I should have just checked her in the "Not worth it" bin. The problem, honestly, has become far more apparent the more financially successful I've become. The predatory, lying behavior I have witnessed from women looking to ingratiate themselves to me is really no different than that of grifters setting up their next mark. I have friends who have married some of these people because they thought they were happy, only to be turned on the moment the ring was slipped on the finger. The problem is that the number of honest, trustworthy people in this world is overshadowed completely by legions, hordes of scum. I have actually started living well below my means, in hopes of finding someone genuine. Yes, foolishly hope still remains. Concerning my own relations with women, I have absolutely been blackmailed on more than one occasion when it comes to sex - this is where the whole "you're sleeping on the couch" thing comes into it. Either agree with her, or you're not getting any - that's why the comment set me off, its blackmail, plain and simple. And concerning women in the workplace, I've also witnessed them use sex as a means to get ahead, or not be fired. Promotions come easy, and the amount of work you're expected to do is low, when you're being nailed by the boss - Hey, hes an asshole too. But that still doesn't forgive her for using her sex to do less work, and in general be less accountable. The problem, again, is that I have a compulsion to forgive women when they should not be forgiven: "yeah that comment was brainless (and the whole line of thought to lead to it even more disturbing), but she's (probably) dynamite in the sack". My attitude is a defense mechanism. That realization, however, doesn't change the fact that the majority of people are untrustworthy, and my attitude is much more of a benefit than a hindrance. I may be a sexist individual because I distrust women on the whole, but I also distrust men on the whole, so "sexist" isn't the right word, how about "careful". As far as women not working, while their husbands do, that again is a fact simply due to biology. Women give birth to children, so they are necessarily going to take time off from work. Childcare is expensive, so until the children go off to school it makes sense that the wife would look after them and her taking time off stagnates her position (not being at work isn't a good way to get promoted). This is all based on economic viability. To say it is sexist would be like saying a lion eating a gazelle is evil. Its just natural. The problem is that, since most people are scum, the wife becomes attached to not working, and when the child is ready to go to school she does not try and get a job. Her indolence comes first- and this only occurs when her income isn't necessary to support the family. Thus while both people worked to begin with, the wife took time off to give birth and raise the child until it was ready for school, and during that time she changed. Which most people do. They change. Which is the heart of issue. To get back to the OP's post, he understands that people change. He thought that he was saving his marriage by doing this relationship book, by staying in tune with his wife. She had other plans. It turns out he chose poorly.
While I disagree with your biological explanation for why women don't work, (not all women have children, you only have to take off work a couple weeks when giving birth, childcare could be shared between both parents working different shifts, etc), I sympathize with your attitude toward humanity. I'm young, probably naive, and from a small, friendly town in south MS. I go to a small, friendly college. So, it makes sense that most of the people I know are friendly people. I don't know too many "scum bags," honestly. My sister is probably the worst I know, but she's got a debilitating disease, so I can find some justification for her marginally "manipulative" behavior - she literally cannot support herself, so maintaining a relationship with someone able to support her is, in her mind, an imperative. I'm sorry you have such a negative view of society. Hopefully you'll be proven wrong at some point in the future. :)
"That is to say, in the majority of cases, the upper middle class household has a working husband and a non-working wife. This should make sense, the wife doesn't need to work when the husband can comfortably support the entire family." Ironically, this is the exact type of community that I reside in, haha. Although in my case, there are very few stay at home wives compared to the number of working mothers/wives. Ah well, I suppose different parts of the middle/upper class NY area have different norms, right?
Hoax, was that really the time or place to let rip a six paragraph explanation about your soap opera compulsions and self defense mechanisms? You seem an interesting enough fella, but you need a sympathetic ear to tell all of your views on women to. Hopefully nobody you love, I suggest you pay the psychiatrist fee. Best of luck in your own pursuit of happiness